Comments on: San Francisco Pilot’s Report Published http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/ A Blog About Ships Fri, 19 Mar 2010 04:36:01 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Col Riv Towboater http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-4092 Col Riv Towboater Thu, 22 Nov 2007 00:51:10 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-4092 Bill, thx, I understand. But...I feel that regardless whether it was a "green crew" or a crew that literally lived thier total lives aboard that Ship, once the radar issues arose AND a language barrier was realized, Capt Coto had every right under several existing rules to drop anchor until the situation was under control. Ive found this site and several others looking for a reason to defend Capt Coto...a fellow Professional Mariner... and I cant find one. Bill, thx, I understand. But…I feel that regardless whether it was a “green crew” or a crew that literally lived thier total lives aboard that Ship, once the radar issues arose AND a language barrier was realized, Capt Coto had every right under several existing rules to drop anchor until the situation was under control.

Ive found this site and several others looking for a reason to defend Capt Coto…a fellow Professional Mariner… and I cant find one.

]]> By: Col Riv Towboater http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-13604 Col Riv Towboater Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:51:10 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-13604 Bill, thx, I understand. But...I feel that regardless whether it was a "green crew" or a crew that literally lived thier total lives aboard that Ship, once the radar issues arose AND a language barrier was realized, Capt Coto had every right under several existing rules to drop anchor until the situation was under control. <br><br>Ive found this site and several others looking for a reason to defend Capt Coto...a fellow Professional Mariner... and I cant find one. Bill, thx, I understand. But…I feel that regardless whether it was a “green crew” or a crew that literally lived thier total lives aboard that Ship, once the radar issues arose AND a language barrier was realized, Capt Coto had every right under several existing rules to drop anchor until the situation was under control.

Ive found this site and several others looking for a reason to defend Capt Coto…a fellow Professional Mariner… and I cant find one.

]]> By: Capt. Bill http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-4083 Capt. Bill Wed, 21 Nov 2007 18:28:41 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-4083 Towboater, no I agree the Rules supersede all which means the capt's to blame. My argument is the blame goes as follows: Cosco: For changing out an entire crew at once Capt: For taking a suicidal job assignment Cota: for leaving in bad weather with these newbies on the bridge Towboater, no I agree the Rules supersede all which means the capt’s to blame. My argument is the blame goes as follows:
Cosco: For changing out an entire crew at once
Capt: For taking a suicidal job assignment
Cota: for leaving in bad weather with these newbies on the bridge

]]> By: Col Riv Towboater http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-4066 Col Riv Towboater Wed, 21 Nov 2007 12:54:55 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-4066 I agree with your assessment Capt Bill except that I believe the existing Pilot Rules and Rules of the Road would prevail over economic or social pressure in this situation. I really hope I am not naive. I understand Cota's predictament but it is not exuse. He should have dogged that ship to the dock & waited for fog to lift or hired a escort thru the first second the radar glitch AND language barrier was apparent. Sorry Capt Cota, Im trying to find a reason to defend you... I agree with your assessment Capt Bill except that I believe the existing Pilot Rules and Rules of the Road would prevail over economic or social pressure in this situation. I really hope I am not naive. I understand Cota’s predictament but it is not exuse. He should have dogged that ship to the dock & waited for fog to lift or hired a escort thru the first second the radar glitch AND language barrier was apparent.

Sorry Capt Cota, Im trying to find a reason to defend you…

]]> By: Cosco Busan - Questions,Questions,Questions « Bob Couttie’s Maritime Accident Casebook http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-3622 Cosco Busan - Questions,Questions,Questions « Bob Couttie’s Maritime Accident Casebook Thu, 15 Nov 2007 23:26:26 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-3622 <!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] Comments San Francisco Pilot&... on Pilot TerrorKFOG Blog on Pilot TerrorCosco Busan - Bridge... on Pilot TerrorSteve [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--> [...] Comments San Francisco Pilot&… on Pilot TerrorKFOG Blog on Pilot TerrorCosco Busan – Bridge… on Pilot TerrorSteve [...]

]]> By: Capt. Bill http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-3616 Capt. Bill Thu, 15 Nov 2007 20:47:44 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-3616 John, I thought I'd post some of our previous discussion. It seems fairly apparent to me and other captains the cause of this situation was the failure of the Chinese bridge team to communicate effectively and know their equipment. I think the biggest failure here was the company changing out an ENTIRE set of officers at once. This is NOT standard practice for American ships. My company never changes out more than one senior officer per port unless there are IMPORTANT extenuating circumstances. Changing out the Chief Mate and Master at the same time is just dangerous because there is no continuity. Changing out the Master, Ch mate, 2nd mate and 3rd mate in the same week is SUICIDAL and it’s no wonder none of them had a clew how to tune the radar or ECDIS. Sorry john I’m going to quote your email, “A ship's quirks, equipment and the interpersonal relationships among the crew are different on every ship and can't be learned in a short period of time.” This is why some companies make a captain sail as chief mate on a ship before giving him command. How else could he learn the Furuno Radar needs an extra 1/4 turn of sea state adjustment to be tuned or that helmsmen XO CHIN tends to oversteer or that the second mate always forgets to put danger bearings in the radar? My assessment: The shipping company was criminal for changing out the entire crew at once The captain was an idiot for accepting such a job The pilot screwed up by not refusing to sail with a brand new crew in poor weather conditions John, I thought I’d post some of our previous discussion.

It seems fairly apparent to me and other captains the cause of this situation was the failure of the Chinese bridge team to communicate effectively and know their equipment.

I think the biggest failure here was the company changing out an ENTIRE set of officers at once. This is NOT standard practice for American ships. My company never changes out more than one senior officer per port unless there are IMPORTANT extenuating circumstances. Changing out the Chief Mate and Master at the same time is just dangerous because there is no continuity. Changing out the Master, Ch mate, 2nd mate and 3rd mate in the same week is SUICIDAL and it’s no wonder none of them had a clew how to tune the radar or ECDIS.

Sorry john I’m going to quote your email, “A ship’s quirks, equipment and the interpersonal relationships among the crew are different on every ship and can’t be learned in a short period of time.”

This is why some companies make a captain sail as chief mate on a ship before giving him command. How else could he learn the Furuno Radar needs an extra 1/4 turn of sea state adjustment to be tuned or that helmsmen XO CHIN tends to oversteer or that the second mate always forgets to put danger bearings in the radar?

My assessment:
The shipping company was criminal for changing out the entire crew at once
The captain was an idiot for accepting such a job
The pilot screwed up by not refusing to sail with a brand new crew in poor weather conditions

]]> By: captstash http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-3558 captstash Thu, 15 Nov 2007 05:15:57 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-3558 The SF pilots don't as a rul utilize the laptop systems and the AIS plug. I am a bit puzzled about th nws rports and the lost radar. All ssls ar requird to have two working radars. So vbn if one quit, there should have been a scond available. Unfortunately our pilotage system does not reinforce safety to the point that a pilot can comfortably refuse to sail a ship, or require it to go to anchor when equipment fails. Perhaps this incident will get us to that point. The SF pilots don’t as a rul utilize the laptop systems and the AIS plug. I am a bit puzzled about th nws rports and the lost radar. All ssls ar requird to have two working radars. So vbn if one quit, there should have been a scond available.

Unfortunately our pilotage system does not reinforce safety to the point that a pilot can comfortably refuse to sail a ship, or require it to go to anchor when equipment fails. Perhaps this incident will get us to that point.

]]> By: John http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-3554 John Thu, 15 Nov 2007 04:06:49 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-3554 David, I do know that type of system exists and I've seen it in use by Tampa Bay Pilots.. I do not know what specifically the SF pilots bring aboard as I have not sailed the bay with a State pilot in at least 5 years. Things might change though. I have to think the Tampa Skyway Bridge disaster had something to do with the implementation of new systems http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/may-9-1980-tampa-skyway-bridge-disaster/ David, I do know that type of system exists and I’ve seen it in use by Tampa Bay Pilots.. I do not know what specifically the SF pilots bring aboard as I have not sailed the bay with a State pilot in at least 5 years.

Things might change though. I have to think the Tampa Skyway Bridge disaster had something to do with the implementation of new systems

http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/may-9-1980-tampa-skyway-bridge-disaster/

]]> By: gCaptain - Maritime News and Tools RSS Mashup http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-3536 gCaptain - Maritime News and Tools RSS Mashup Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:32:22 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-3536 <!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] San Francisco Pilot’s Report Published [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--> [...] San Francisco Pilot’s Report Published [...]

]]> By: David Hindin http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/comment-page-1/#comment-3531 David Hindin Wed, 14 Nov 2007 20:50:27 +0000 http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/san-francisco-pilots-report-published/#comment-3531 I am under the impression that the pilot comes aboard the ship with his own laptop loaded with charts. The laptop has an interface to the "Pilot Port" of the ship's AIS system giving him connectivity to the ships GPS and the other navigation systems. This connectivity gives the pilot the same AIS derived picture that VTS sees. Can someone affirm or deny my assertion regarding SF pilots. If I am correct, the pilot can navigate from his own laptop making it unnecessary for him to (mis)interpret the ships chart display? I am under the impression that the pilot comes aboard the ship with his own laptop loaded with charts. The laptop has an interface to the “Pilot Port” of the ship’s AIS system giving him connectivity to the ships GPS and the other navigation systems. This connectivity gives the pilot the same AIS derived picture that VTS sees. Can someone affirm or deny my assertion regarding SF pilots. If I am correct, the pilot can navigate from his own laptop making it unnecessary for him to (mis)interpret the ships chart display?

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