U.S.C.G. Lic. "Merchant Mariner"

[Sweat-n-Grease]

Just thought of something, there may be a sizable amount of members reading the thread and wondering what a "License Board," also called a "License Rack" is.

[Capt. Phoenix]

WHAT !! No more License Board to show-off your stuff? Do tell - how things change! Most likely a money saving idea, I've no problem with it, seems like a streamline thing to do but no paper license anymore, with pretty sketches of ships passing through the night, your issue number so folks can see how long in the tooth you are, and the official seal of the USCG embossed, and all that sort of stuff! BTW, best not lose your wallet.

The MMC looks like a military passport. Its a red passport style book that replaces your mmd, license, and stcw sheet.

[Capt.Felix]

WHAT !! No more License Board to show-off your stuff? Do tell - how things change! Most likely a money saving idea, I've no problem with it, seems like a streamline thing to do but no paper license anymore, with pretty sketches of ships passing through the night, your issue number so folks can see how long in the tooth you are, and the official seal of the USCG embossed, and all that sort of stuff! BTW, best not lose your wallet.

You can print your own if youd like off the coasties maritime website. I personally wish they still issued the drivers lic type ids though. I have to constantly keep the passport type with me as i have it checked almost everyday by port master.

[Sweat-n-Grease]

What I demand them to say is "YESSS MAAASTER" and then drag themselves away but since they don't, everybody on my ship calls me captain instead. A very few (my chief mate and engineer mainly) can use my first name but only if it is in private or others can only if it is prefaced by captain when in public (although I wished they didn't). Addressing the master with only his first name is something I allowed when I was a young master and wanted to be "liked" by my people but I found out soon enough that didn't work!

True that ..
The same applies for the Chief Engineer, always address the C/E as Chief, in my early years we were called by our positions: "The Mate" always meant Chief Mate, then followed 2nd Mate, 3rd Mate. "The Chief" was the C/E, then First, Second, Third. It worked. BTW, When the Captain was really angry at The Mate he addressed him as Mister Mate. Ough Oh!!

[Steamer]

"What I demand them to say is "YESSS MAAASTER" and then drag themselves away ..."

I kind of like it when they genuflect while saying "YESSS CHIEFFFF" and leave the area walking backwards in a kind of half bow.

[Sweat-n-Grease]

You can print your own if youd like off the coasties maritime website. I personally wish they still issued the drivers lic type ids though. I have to constantly keep the passport type with me as i have it checked almost everyday by port master.

I can understand. In most ports we had to surrender our MMD as we passed out the gate. I never was comfortable with that. Never had a problem though.

[Sweat-n-Grease]

"What I demand them to say is "YESSS MAAASTER" and then drag themselves away ..."

I kind of like it when they genuflect while saying "YESSS CHIEFFFF" and leave the area walking backwards in a kind of half bow.

Oh my goodness .. I heard things have changed but I had no idea.

[anchorman]

Oh my goodness .. I heard things have changed but I had no idea.

That is mostly a joke. Those in command expect to be treated like one, but the 'proper technical' licensing terms are hardly used, and not very many good Captain's, Master's, or Chief's have to request how they want to be addressed. Things like that fall into place while focusing on the real issues. I never seen it an issue - EVER, but I have worked with weak Captains that love situations just for the fact of an opportunity to reiterate they are the Captain. I am the Captain!

[cmakin]

That is mostly a joke. Those in command expect to be treated like one, but the 'proper technical' licensing terms are hardly used, and not very many good Captain's, Master's, or Chief's have to request how they want to be addressed. Things like that fall into place while focusing on the real issues. I never seen it an issue - EVER, but I have worked with weak Captains that love situations just for the fact of an opportunity to reiterate they are the Captain. I am the Captain!

Hey, I sailed with him, too.

[MariaW]

If you go around calling yourself master mariner, it is only a fabrication to make oneself larger than you really are hence the pomposity reference. I have met such people and they drive me nuts (but so does everything else for that matter)

Did you read the Wikipedia article? The term "master" has been in use in the trades a long time and denotes that you've completed your apprenticeship, journeymanship, etc. and (in the times of the guilds) have completed your master work. That's where the word "masterpiece" comes from. It means you have "mastered" your profession. It is a trade term rooted in fact and has nothing to do with how you view yourself.

That being said, I can't imagine someone saying "I'm a master mariner", "I'm a master carpenter", etc., these days. It's more likely a term you use on someone else. I've heard the job of master of a ship described most often as "sea captain". That term is most understandable for the non-mariner world out there I think.

[JW-Oceans]

United States Merchant Marine Officer.... That's what my first License said.... That's what I put on applications... That's what I say when asked.

[cajuntugster]

What would you call someone who sails on a ship without sails, Maria?[/QUOTE]

A motorer??? A carbon cruiser?

[Steamer]

What would you call someone who sails on a ship without sails, Maria?

A Motor Boater, or if they are really good, a Steamboater.

[Sweat-n-Grease]

United States Merchant Marine Officer.... That's what my first License said.... That's what I put on applications... That's what I say when asked.

Granted JW, it's a matter of choice. Did you know "Bull" Halsey always referred to himself as a "Navy Sailor," and of course he was. He also happened to be one our best fighting Fleet Admirals during WWII. At the end of his life one of the most famous Generals of WWII ("I shall return") said this of himself: "I am but a simple soldier who always tried to do my duty as best I could." Yes, he was a soldier.

[Steamer]

Oh my goodness .. I heard things have changed but I had no idea.

Maybe I should have added the grinning smiley ...

[CaptAndrew]

Lots of good stuff here but all related to the US system. There are others on the forum who are from other countries where the terminology is different. Most, maybe all other countries do not have Captain or Master's "Licenses" they have "Certificate of Competency" and you have to look back to days of sail to see the origins of the terms. A ship could have a Captain and a Master. The Captain might not have much experience, kind of like some yachties today. On the other hand the "Sailing Master", a lower position, actually knew his stuff and took care of the business of driving the ship. An example of this was "Captain" Cook and his "Sailing Master" William Bligh.

I also notice some confusion between a Marine the soldier who's job used to be on a ship and Mariner who's work is on a ship.

It's all entertainment.

[Sweat-n-Grease]

Maybe I should have added the grinning smiley ...

To think, all along I thought it was true ~|~

[c.captain]

Lots of good stuff here but all related to the US system. There are others on the forum who are from other countries where the terminology is different. Most, maybe all other countries do not have Captain or Master's "Licenses" they have "Certificate of Competency" and you have to look back to days of sail to see the origins of the terms. A ship could have a Captain and a Master. The Captain might not have much experience, kind of like some yachties today. On the other hand the "Sailing Master", a lower position, actually knew his stuff and took care of the business of driving the ship. An example of this was "Captain" Cook and his "Sailing Master" William Bligh.

I do not believe anywhere today the term "captain" is used in lieu of "master" certainly this is the case with the US

Additionally:

SOLAS=master
STCW=master
STCW(F)=skipper (really!)
MODU=person in charge

Also in the Royal Navy in the days of sail all the info is to be found in WIkipedia here

[c.captain]

Granted JW, it's a matter of choice. Did you know "Bull" Halsey always referred to himself as a "Navy Sailor," and of course he was. He also happened to be one our best fighting Fleet Admirals during WWII. At the end of his life one of the most famous Generals of WWII ("I shall return") said this of himself: "I am but a simple soldier who always tried to do my duty as best I could." Yes, he was a soldier.

Remember Halsey was USN and Navy uses "sailor" as in soldier, sailor & airman

MacArthur was no soldier! Rather he was the equivalent of Capt. Kenneth R. Force USMS...so unbelievably full of his own self importance as to be ridicuous. He of course, got his in the end and I applaud Truman immensely for the courage to do what he had to do rather than pander to those who were MacArthur's supporters in the Congress. FDR was so terribly weak in this regard but at least he (and Marshall) made damned sure Mac never had any command in the ETO. The SW Pacific was not the prize...that rightly went to Eisenhower and Bradley. They were real generals...MacArthur was simply a poseur and a coward! Sneaking away from the Phillipines in the middle of the night. A brave soldier would have stood with his troops and refused FDR's "order" for him to leave. Again, FDR pandering to the Republicans in the Congress and Mac going yellow... way to go "Dugout Doug"

[Sweat-n-Grease]

Remember Halsey was USN and Navy uses "sailor" as in soldier, sailor & airman

MacArthur as the equivalent of Capt. Kenneth R. Force USMS...so unbelievably full of his own self importance as to be ridicuous. He of course, got his in the end and I applaud Truman immensely for the courage to do what he had to do rather than pander to those who were MacArthur's supporters in the Congress. FDR was so terribly weak in this regard but at least he (and Marshall) made damned sure Mac never had any command in the ETO. The SW Pacific was not the prize...that rightly went to Eisenhower and Bradley. They were real generals...MacArthur was simply a poseur and a coward! Way to go "Dugout Doug"

Oh my goodness .. I was only trying to make a point ~ a word is a word is a word.
Should I have ran into a Chief Engineer, back in my sailing days, who demanded to be addresses as The High Lord of Underworld, I most definitely would greet him as he entered the engine room in this manner: "Good Morning your High Lordship"
BTW, I agree with your opinion of the Great General.
Looks like I'll have to read about this Capt. Kenneth R Force, USMS, I know you posted the story but simply looking at his picture soured my morning.

Need to edit:
I read the story. Man, this guy has been all over the map, Port Chester High School Band, The Black Watch Band (don't mess with the Black Watch), and on and on and on.
Shifting gears here:
I'll repost my thoughts that the USMMA facilities should be open to all active US Merchant Seaman, Licensed and Unlicensed, for training and upgrading. The need for the USMMA to produce a pool of Naval Reserve Officers seems moot (plenty of NROTC at Universities) so end the need to mirror Annapolis, and get on with being an institution dedicated to the advancement of U S Merchant Seamen.
Some folks will not be pleased with my comments, some folks will be pleased, in any case these are the sincere opinions of a US Merchant Seaman who graduated from KP. I am grateful for the American Tax Payers who paid my way through KP. I met the KP mission, the one in play back in 1962 that is.