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Thread: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

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    Jacknthebox is offline gCaptain Crew
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    Default Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    If I work on a unlimited tonnage tanker for example for 12 hours a day, does this count as a day and half of sea time?
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    Mr 100-ton's Avatar
    Mr 100-ton is offline Top Contributer Greenhorn
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    It should,, but depends on how your sea time letter is worded.
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    anchorman is offline Super Moderator
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Quote Originally Posted by Jacknthebox View Post
    If I work on a unlimited tonnage tanker for example for 12 hours a day, does this count as a day and half of sea time?
    No, not on tankers.
    "Captain standard operating procedure for decision making is to do what feels right to you at the time, and then to give logical sounding justifications for what you were already going to do anyway" -
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    Steamer is offline Top Contributer
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Are you working 4 hours OT each day or are you standing watch for 12 hours a day? OT doesn't count, watchstanding does.
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Quote Originally Posted by Jacknthebox View Post
    If I work on a unlimited tonnage tanker for example for 12 hours a day, does this count as a day and half of sea time?
    Most likely, no. One and one-half credit for a 12-hour day is appropriate when the 12-hour day is "authorized and practiced." As used here, the terms are not redundant, it's a two-part requirement. "Authorized" means a 12-hour, two-watch rotation is permitted by law and the vessel's certificate of inspection. "Practiced" means the 2-watch system was in actual practice on the vessel while you served on it.

    Eequirements for how many watches are required on a vessel are specified in 46 U.S.C. 8104 and 46 CFR 15.705.
    James D. Cavo
    U.S. Coast Guard
    Mariner Credentialing Program
    Policy Division (CG-5434)
    James.D.Cavo@uscg.mil
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Since your company has graciously 'allowed' you to work your 8 hour watch, and then be required to 'volunteer' up to 4 hours OT per day, you only get credit for the 8 hour watch. Ask them to write you a 'sea service letter'. I will bet it is specifically worded to say you have worked "XX number of days." which would reflect your 8 hour days.
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    People who work for US Shipping get 12 hour letters all the time. However, I don't believe there is any paid OT - it's salaried, but you're still only standing 8 hours of watch, and the 4 hours of OT is expected.
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    Steamer is offline Top Contributer
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Quote Originally Posted by New3M View Post
    People who work for US Shipping get 12 hour letters all the time. However, I don't believe there is any paid OT - it's salaried, but you're still only standing 8 hours of watch, and the 4 hours of OT is expected.
    Geez, you must have been working for some backwoods muddy water outfits!

    Even the standard 12 hour contracts I have worked under (AMHS - WSF) still pay overtime and the USCG counts it as 1.5 days. The tanker and dry cargo ship contracts call for an 8 hour day and pay overtime for weekends and after 8 hours (pus a few other little items) but only count as 1 day for USCG purposes.
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    I never worked for them, but I have several friends that upgraded the quick way by going there and getting a 12 hour letter.
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Quote Originally Posted by New3M View Post
    I never worked for them, but I have several friends that upgraded the quick way by going there and getting a 12 hour letter.
    Whether U.S. Shipping vewssels are eligible for the 12-hour day has nothing to do with labor contracts. U.S. Shippng operates ATBs. ATBs are manned as towing vessels, and thus per 46 USC 8104(g) may be authorized to have two watches.
    James D. Cavo
    U.S. Coast Guard
    Mariner Credentialing Program
    Policy Division (CG-5434)
    James.D.Cavo@uscg.mil
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    Steamer is offline Top Contributer
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Quote Originally Posted by jdcavo View Post
    Whether U.S. Shipping vewssels are eligible for the 12-hour day has nothing to do with labor contracts.
    Nobody ever said it did.

    The poster stated that they worked 8 hour watches and had to do 4 hours OT for free and were getting "12 hour letters."

    US Shipping also operates real ships, the poster did not specify ATB's so 8 hours of watches is what he said it was. Adding 4 hours of forced labor makes it 12. If the CG counts that as 1.5 days then there is a problem with CG evaluators.
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    anchorman is offline Super Moderator
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    Default Re: Question about sea time and the 12 hour day

    Quote Originally Posted by Steamer View Post
    Nobody ever said it did.

    The poster stated that they worked 8 hour watches and had to do 4 hours OT for free and were getting "12 hour letters."

    US Shipping also operates real ships, the poster did not specify ATB's so 8 hours of watches is what he said it was. Adding 4 hours of forced labor makes it 12. If the CG counts that as 1.5 days then there is a problem with CG evaluators.
    I think Jim can read. He was just stating the obvious based on what was posted and put it into context. We now know that ATBs get 12 hour days, not the US shipping fleet. We now know that OT has nothing to do on how a 12 hour day is credited within the regulations - OT is a labor issue. You may have known both, as did I, but he wasn't talking to you as you pointed out by referencing "the poster".
    "Captain standard operating procedure for decision making is to do what feels right to you at the time, and then to give logical sounding justifications for what you were already going to do anyway" -
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