Foreign vessels on GOM clean up...

[mtskier]

Greetings All,
Have any of you noticed the video stream presented by BP is coming from the MV Skandi Neptune? I believe this is a Norwegian flagged vessel isn't it? This seems like an opportunity for the US maritime industry to point out the issues of foreign flagged vessels working in US waters...
MTSKIER

[Kennebec Captain]

Funny you should put it that way. The Jones Act has been blamed for hindering the clean up. Google "Jones Act" Oil spill etc. My post about the kerfuffle is here

[mtskier]

KC,
Looked through the yammering after your post. I never cease to be amazed at the uninformed opinions that people are willing to hold dear regardless of their lack of actual knowledge or research.
MTSKIER

[Shellback]

Not someone who works in the gulf normally ,does anyone know if there are boats still layed up?
I have seen boats of all kinds, at MC252, that have been pulling boom and have portable recovery tanks and skimmers out there..This isn't hard to do..

I have been busy lately but last I heard we had 10% unemployment, I guess that has changed?????

[seadawg]

while I am a strong advocate of US waters-US crews-US vessels..the extraordinary circumstance of this catastrophe dictates an extraordinary response..the US may need help on this one..do still feel that US resources should aways have priority whenever possible..there will be the inevitable abuses and those perpetrators will need to be dealt with quickly and severely!!

[Barbeque]

In my opinion, if we didn't outsource our oil fields to Foreign companies this probably would not have happened, Our government grants a large amount of leniency to foreign interests and more often then not turns a blind eye towards maintaining up to date US standards and regulations. This should not have happened, but it did. and Now, we have to deal with the consequences.

The people of the united states are strong only in times of crisis such as this, I have little doubt that the problem will be dealt with primarily by the people while working in tandem with the government to clean up this massive ecological disaster. Now, weather we like it or not, this oil spill has created a major economic boom in the gulf area which will provide a large amount of relief to many people who were struggling, but at the same same will leave a massive swath of destruction in its wake. The Fishing Industry has suffered its own version of Armageddon, the restaurants can no longer supply the food the residents are used to, The beaches that drew large crowds of tourist are dirty and unsafe now and due to that massive amounts of business will suffer and most likely cease to exist in the coming years.

The American people can handle this disaster, just as its handled many other hurtles in its past. So my answer to your question, No I am quite positive that we have had more then enough foreign involvement and interests in our affairs to last us a generation. I would like to wright quite a bit more here, but sadly its time for me get up and get breakfast ready for the day so Adieu.

[capitanahn]

Greetings All,
Have any of you noticed the video stream presented by BP is coming from the MV Skandi Neptune? I believe this is a Norwegian flagged vessel isn't it? This seems like an opportunity for the US maritime industry to point out the issues of foreign flagged vessels working in US waters...
MTSKIER

I am infuriated at the stupidity of our nation allowing that to happen..Even if it was a good will gesture....
But it is not, there are american jobs being robbed. We, U.S. seamen can clean up the mess. & BP must pay.

[tengineer]

I don't know how many US spill response vessels are standing by with nothing to do, I doubt very many. There may or may not be other support vessels available to do the same job as the Skandi. But, there should be US mariners on that vessel unless they have an exemption from the USCG. You can bet Norway wouldn't allow any US vessels into their waters without an exemption. By the way was the Deepwater Horizon US flagged? WE must also remember BP is British Petroleum, you know the Texas refinery explosion folks that paid a fine and kept right on violating. We kicked them out of the country a couple of hundred years ago, we should do it again. There are some other oil companies that can do what BP does, we'll live without them and probably longer thank you very much.
The use of this disaster by Fox News and other so called "news agencies" to attempt to blame the Jones Act or complain about the nonexistent union labor in the Gulf of Mexico hampering the cleanup is sickening. The question is...who is really feeding this information to these "news" guys and where's their proof or are they just mouthpieces for the kind of people that created this mess to begin with?

[mariner173]

It is sickening to listen to the likes of Kudlow on CNBC endless blast the Jones Act for part of this mess. It is bad enough that he does not know what is involved with the Jones Act and that there is already masses of Foreign ships operating on the spill (I'm of the believe that there is enough work to go around for everyone down there at the current moment!) He has ulterior motives when it comes to anything he says which in my opinion leads to the likes of these messes (Free Trade, Rights of Business, etc etc)

[bnhpr]

I dont think I've ever seen a US flag ultra deepwater vessel in the GOM.

[WW Sailor]

witch us-vessels can be compared to the Norwegian fleet working on the oil spill??? Viking poseidon, skandi neptun, ocean intevention3, boa sub c, boa deep c, rem forza...
And don't they all have a variety of crew onboard??? even u.s. citizens
I still don't know where the thing about us vessels not being allowed in Norwegian waters comes from??! theres a lot of foreign flagged vessels with foreign crew working in the north sea.

[anchorman]

witch us-vessels can be compared to the Norwegian fleet working on the oil spill??? Viking poseidon, skandi neptun, ocean intevention3, boa sub c, boa deep c, rem forza...
And don't they all have a variety of crew onboard??? even u.s. citizens
I still don't know where the thing about us vessels not being allowed in Norwegian waters comes from??! Norwegian Law theres a lot of foreign flagged vessels with foreign crew working in the north sea.

Norway has two ship registers. NOR, and NIS. To work domestically, in Norway, you have to be under the NOR register. Only a ship that is managed, crewed, and has an office in Norway can be NOR registered. Only norwegians are allowed to be crew on these vessels. Most of the ones that you mentioned are NOR registered on Jones Act waivers.

NIS registered vessels can fly the Norwegian flag, employee foreign crew except the Captain, abide by Norwegian law, but cannot work domestically in Norway and compete against NOR vessels. Currently, US mariners cannot even work on NIS registered vessels because of STCW related issues.

So, as long as a Norwegian vessel, no matter how it's registered, NOR or NIS, the operating company, by law of their flag state, cannot employee US mariners if they wanted to - register doesn't matter.

As far as the waiver, most people would have no problem with that minus what I just posted. There are some comparable US flagged vessels, plus one being built in Tampa that will put most of those to shame, but all are working and are not currently effected by the waivers, but there should be US mariners on those vessels.

[dougpine]

The Chouest OSRV "Nanuq" is sitting up in Seward, AK right now. She was on her way up when the spill happened, on contract to Shell if I'm not mistaken. I don't think Shell is too busy up there just about now.

[anchorman]

The Chouest OSRV "Nanuq" is sitting up in Seward, AK right now. She was on her way up when the spill happened, on contract to Shell if I'm not mistaken. I don't think Shell is too busy up there just about now.

They are crew changing and heading back to the gulf. Too bad they were gone when the DWH happened. They would be the shining star with their oil response capability. The 6 month moratorium was announced while the Nanuq was on the west coast, underway to Alaska, that pretty much cancelled Shell's drilling plans in Alaska, for this year and beyond.

[Diesel]

They are crew changing and heading back to the gulf. Too bad they were gone when the DWH happened. They would be the shining star with their oil response capability. The 6 month moratorium was announced while the Nanuq was on the west coast, underway to Alaska, that pretty much cancelled Shell's drilling plans in Alaska, for this year and beyond.

Nah, that plan got scrapped they went to minimum manning and are staying up there. BTW Nathan Anderson is back, so we have someone to harass.

[WW Sailor]

Norway has two ship registers. NOR, and NIS. To work domestically, in Norway, you have to be under the NOR register. Only a ship that is managed, crewed, and has an office in Norway can be NOR registered. Only norwegians are allowed to be crew on these vessels. Most of the ones that you mentioned are NOR registered on Jones Act waivers.

NIS registered vessels can fly the Norwegian flag, employee foreign crew except the Captain, abide by Norwegian law, but cannot work domestically in Norway and compete against NOR vessels. Currently, US mariners cannot even work on NIS registered vessels because of STCW related issues.

So, as long as a Norwegian vessel, no matter how it's registered, NOR or NIS, the operating company, by law of their flag state, cannot employee US mariners if they wanted to - register doesn't matter.

As far as the waiver, most people would have no problem with that minus what I just posted. There are some comparable US flagged vessels, plus one being built in Tampa that will put most of those to shame, but all are working and are not currently effected by the waivers, but there should be US mariners on those vessels.

Nor vessels demand norwegian wages and agreements. there are many swedish, danish, british, polish, and other nationalities on Nor flagged vessels with norwegian agreements.
To work in norwegian domestic waters you can have what ever flag you want. on the coastal trade there's a lot of bahamas and now faeroese flagged ships. Offshore theres Island of man, cyprus, panama, and even Nis!
Nis vessels can get an exception from the NMD and thats all. Nis Flag vessels are competing against Nor every day.

"TRADING AREA RESTRICTIONS
Ships registered in the Norwegian International Ship Register are not permitted to carry cargo or passengers between Norwegian ports or to engage in regular scheduled passenger transport between Norwegian and foreign ports.
For the purpose of this Act, oil and gas installations on the Norwegian continental shelf are regarded as Norwegian ports.
This paragraph leaves open the possibility for the Norwegian Maritime Directorate to issue dispensations to the trading area restrictions."

The thing about the captain beeing norwegian could be avoided by a few weeks on a course in norwegian regulations.
I've been working on both Uk and Nis vessels that have been in the north sea, carrying cargo and operating both between ports and installations.

"Currently, US mariners cannot even work on NIS registered vessels because of STCW related issues."
why dont anyone start to work against the uscg to get them to accept Stcw and start converting to the rest of the world??

[anchorman]

Nor vessels demand norwegian wages and agreements. there are many swedish, danish, british, polish, and other nationalities on Nor flagged vessels with norwegian agreements.
To work in norwegian domestic waters you can have what ever flag you want. on the coastal trade there's a lot of bahamas and now faeroese flagged ships. Offshore theres Island of man, cyprus, panama, and even Nis!
Nis vessels can get an exception from the NMD and thats all. Nis Flag vessels are competing against Nor every day.

"TRADING AREA RESTRICTIONS
Ships registered in the Norwegian International Ship Register are not permitted to carry cargo or passengers between Norwegian ports or to engage in regular scheduled passenger transport between Norwegian and foreign ports.
For the purpose of this Act, oil and gas installations on the Norwegian continental shelf are regarded as Norwegian ports.
This paragraph leaves open the possibility for the Norwegian Maritime Directorate to issue dispensations to the trading area restrictions."

The thing about the captain beeing norwegian could be avoided by a few weeks on a course in norwegian regulations.
I've been working on both Uk and Nis vessels that have been in the north sea, carrying cargo and operating both between ports and installations.

"Currently, US mariners cannot even work on NIS registered vessels because of STCW related issues."
why dont anyone start to work against the uscg to get them to accept Stcw and start converting to the rest of the world??

Obviously, you know what you're talking about, because most of what you said is true, but some things need further elaboration. To be non-Norwegian and Captain of a NIS vessel, you also need the operating company to apply for an exemption with NMD. That has to be approved, as well as that person having the right certifications as you mentioned. This is not possible on NOR vessels from what I understand. I'm no maritime Lawyer, but I've been in Island Offshore office in Ulsteinvik, talking with Havard, Jan, and the HR departments about crewing among other things. I was there touring the many vessels that Gary Chouest and Morten Ulstein have together, with ECO management, and it was very clear at the time that US vessels cannot work in Norwegian domestic waters.

[JP]

I have tried to apply to various companies overseas.I was told by the Norwegians that they do not hire Americans, thats all there is to it. I have worked on some foreign flagged vessels in the Gulf but they were all American owned and at least partly American operated. Bahamas and Vanuatu flags. The vessel I am on right now is Bahamas flag with foreign crew. All marine crew is foreign except me. Right now they are desperately looking for DPOs to replace me and they will accept Americans right now because they need someone very quickly! Usually, all marine crew is foreign. The project people, divers, ROV, etc are Americans mostly. I keep hearing that we do not have enough Americans to fill the spots. I am starting to wonder if that is correct? I have posted and contacted everyone I know and all DPOs are already working!

[anchorman]

I have tried to apply to various companies overseas.I was told by the Norwegians that they do not hire Americans, thats all there is to it.

They cannot hire Americans, but hopefully, they will be able to in the near future.

[bnhpr]

Who would want to work with a primarily Norwegian crew?

purgatory...